Verizon filed an application with the FCC in September to phase them out, but Catskills residents objected and now the FCC has paused the process.
Read the full transcript below:
Annie Bennett: This is WAMC's Northeast Notebook. I'm Annie Bennett.
Kimberly Izar: For a lot of customers, it was actually their only source of communication.
Annie Bennett: You might think that landline phones are relics of the past. And it is true that they're less popular today. But, they're still hanging around.
Janet Andersen: My ability to contact somebody in an emergency, or even non-emergency, is really limited.
Annie Bennett: In 2024, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce reported that around 30% of adults use landlines and that rate is about 10% higher in the Northeast. And out of all 50 states, New York takes the prize. Over half of Empire State adults use a landline. At least one carrier hopes to phase out copper-based landlines across the country. But where does that leave the region's most vulnerable residents?
Meg Soltis: It seems as if there was no forethought for the safety of the community.
Diana Alvear: The copper lines themselves are very much an aging infrastructure. We're talking 100 years old... Hi, I'm Diana Alvear, and I'm a media relations spokesperson for Verizon.
Annie Bennett: Diana told me that Verizon is making the switch away from copper in an attempt to prioritize its customers.
Diana Alvear: Repairs are taking longer, and that puts our customers at significant risk if they can't communicate with folks. So, what we're trying to do is modernize this infrastructure.
Annie Bennett: But some Northeasterners say that communication risk is actually why they need their landlines. Kimberly Izar has been covering this story for Radio Catskill ever since residents started getting letters alerting them to a potential change in coverage back in September.
Kimberly Izar: We started getting phone calls and emails from customers who were concerned that they were going to lose their main source of communication, their landline telephone. So, Verizon filed this application with the FCC sometime in September to phase out its copper-based landline services.
Annie Bennett: The request to phase out copper is pending in Washington. The FCC application paused the automatic approval process after public outcry.
Janet Andersen: I really rely on my landline. Um, my cell service is very poor in my area. Quite often, if I get a call on the cell phone, I have to tell people, "Call back on my landline. I can't understand you."
Annie Bennett: Janet Andersen was one of over a hundred people who left feedback in the comments section of the FCC's website. I asked her to tell us how she feels:
Janet Andersen: Your product is really important to a lot of people, and you should be proud of that and happy about that. Please don't take it away without leaving some or making some other service available to the users who really rely on this product.
Annie Bennett: But Verizon says that's a mischaracterization.
Diana Alvear: There are some copper landline customers that don't have other options, and so they're going to keep their copper landline service.
Annie to Diana: What does Verizon consider to be a viable replacement? What are, like, the standards for that?
Diana Alvear: Yeah, it really depends on the customer's needs. Um, again, you know, like, where they're at, what they're using, um, what's available in that specific area...
Annie to Diana: But, I'm guessing there must be some sort of, like, standard that Verizon is setting if they're saying, "We will not do this if you meet these requirements." What are those requirements?
Diana Alvear: So, in some cases, it's going to be which fiber options are available, which wireless options are available, um... But again, I can't-
Annie to Diana: But is it like they have to have access during emergency services? They have to have access during this stuff? Like...
Diana Alvear: The... I guess the reason I'm, I feel like I'm being stumped right now because - I'm aware of the FCC requirements, which are ample notification and then viable options. But in terms of what those viable options are defined by, I don't have that information.
Annie to Diana: Okay.
Diana Alvear: I would probably have to go back and look.
Annie Bennett: Kimberly Izar tells me that Verizon's lack of clarity is creating confusion.
Kimberly Izar: I'm still very curious about what Verizon's rollout plan will look like to actually verify that these residents have viable alternatives. And then also, you know, when I spoke to Verizon, they said that they don't want any impact at all towards emergency services and 911. But like I, as we talked about with Phoenicia Library, I just don't fully understand how there would be no impact if so much of it is connected.
Annie Bennett: The Phoenicia Library is where people come together in this Catskills valley trail town and it's also hooked up to a landline. Meg Soltis is a library clerk there. She says that many of the library's patrons are elderly, and really worried about their phones, in many cases their lifelines, getting disconnected.
Meg Soltis: The conversations are heartbreaking. Um, people saying, "I'm 82 years old. What's going to happen if I have to call 911? I need my copper landline. I've had it for 50 years. Why can't I keep it?" Um, and these are people I know do not have cell phones because there is no cell service up there. And they can't afford it anyway. They're on very fixed incomes.
Annie Bennett: I asked Diana, the Verizon spokesperson, about potential cost increases for landline customers.
Diana Alvear: One of the things that we agreed to do is to maintain pricing, either comparable pricing or in some cases some people are gonna be paying less.
Annie Bennett: When I asked her though if comparable meant the same or similar, and thus could include slight increases, she was unable to provide a clear answer.
Diana Alvear: I don't have pricing information. I think that that's... it really is highly dependent on what your options are.
Annie Bennett: Meg, the librarian, is skeptical. She remembers the devastating flooding the region experienced during Hurricane Irene 15 years ago.
Meg Soltis: We had trouble with our phone lines, and a parent of a student I taught was the Regional Manager of Cable Splitters for Verizon at the time. And he said, "Oh, don't bother." You know, he goes, "We were given instructions not to fix the spliced copper cable in Town of Olive, so you might as well get rid of your landline. They're not gonna fix it." And, um, I realized...
Annie to Meg: Wait, so, just to make sure I understand: So, it wasn't that they took it out, like pre-planned. It was that it got damaged in a storm and Verizon was like, "Well, we're not going to spend time fixing it."
Meg Soltis: Correct. And that was back around 2011. Fast-forward years and years and years of this, every time we lose electricity, which is often because we are rural, um, our Spectrum line goes down at the same time our electric goes down. So, we have no phone, except we get one to two bars on a cell line.
Annie Bennett: Is Meg's story of losing reliable service going to be the reality for more people after this change?
Diana Alvear: So that is one thing that I wouldn't be able to comment on because, um, quite frankly, I'd have to go back and see what happened with that.
Annie Bennett: I did send Verizon a follow up over email but did not receive a reply. In 2012, though, Huff Post reported on this issue in Manhattan. Their article from 14 years ago reads, "But in the storm's wake, Verizon sees an opportunity to modernize its network." Chris Levendos, Verizon’s Executive Director of National Operations at the time, is quoted as saying, “If there's an area of the network we did not build fiber to yet, now is an opportunity to fill those gaps."
Annie Bennett: Concerns of New Yorkers like Janet and Meg have reached the halls of the nation's capitol.
Kimberly Izar: Yeah, Schumer wrote a letter, uh, earlier this week. He sent it to the CEO of Verizon, pretty much asking these questions.
Annie Bennett: One of the questions that Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer is asking is about Life Alert and similar medical devices that are connected to copper lines.
Meg Soltis: Having gotten it for my own mother many years ago, I think that it's going to be a huge problem. Cable lines and cells do not work in the area, so it has always run through copper lines.
Diana Alvear: And the FCC requires these carriers to ensure that the latest versions of their medical devices and Life Alert devices are compatible with wireless services as well. It's a matter of the customer calling their medical device carrier and letting them know, "Hey, I may need to move to X option."
Annie Bennett: At the time of this reporting, Verizon told WAMC that it could not comment yet, specifically on Senator Schumer's letter. And customers are also waiting for answers.
Meg Soltis: I'm really worried for these people. Um, this is a real threat to our elders in our society right now.
Annie Bennett: Northeast Notebook is a production of WAMC Northeast Public Radio. Our Executive Producer is Lucas Willard. Our Editor is Diane Devore. Original Music by Eduardo Rivera. Consider subscribing to Northeast Notebook wherever you get your podcasts. If you did enjoy the show, or, hey, even if you didn't, we'd love for you to rate and review. It's just one small way you can support public radio. This episode was hosted and produced by me, Annie Bennett. Thank you for listening.
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